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"Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage" (Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage)
08/31/2014 at 19:09 • Filed to: None

Hey Oppo. Was wondering if any of you guys could answer a few questions for me. One of my good friends is looking to buy his first car. He's not really a car enthusiast by any means, but has always been somewhat interested in them. He has his heart set on buying a Camaro or Firebird. Considering we live in Michigan and he would have to drive it every day, I'm not sure this would be the best option for him, even if it was a V6. I know a RWD car is doable in the winter, but he seems like the kind of guy that would not be very careful with it. So I've been thinking of alternatives for him. He likes all Camaros and Firebirds, but likes the 3rd Gen the most. So, today, I thought about the Dodge Daytona and the Plymouth Laser. These are FWD, but kind look like a softer 3rd Gen Firebird, in my opinion. My only issue with it is the reliability. I figured, since the G-Platform was derived from the K-Platform, it was not that reliable I was wondering if any of you had any experience involving a Daytona or a Laser. Are they reliable, or was I correct in thinking it was not that reliable? Or, do any of you guys have suggestions for a car for him? He wants an American car, and it must be reliable. He does not want a Mustang. Top dollar for him would probably be around $4k. He says that he would learn to drive a stick, but I think an auto would be the best option for him. RWD suggestions are definitely accepted, but I will have to pound in his head that he will have to be careful with it. Thanks in advance!

DISCUSSION (38)

beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:14

Camaro or Firebird and skidpan lessons.

PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:17

Depends how much he can spend. I'd suggest a 1st gen ford focus or a late 90's Chevy S-10 4WD for him if he doesn't wanna spend a lot. If he's got $5-7K, he might as well take a look at WRX's. I'm not too sure of the prices of them over in Mich. but here in WA state, you can find one for a very reasonable amount.

GhostZ > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:18

RWD, salt and kitty litter weighing down the rear, and he'll be fine. FWD is only better on snow if its got a lot of weight over the drive wheels. The Daytona, with its lightweight engine and long nose, doesn't have that. A Civic would be better. Not only that, but the difference isn't bigger than the difference between snow tires and regular tires. If he's too lazy to buy snow tires, he shouldn't be buying a $4k car.

The Daytona will be much more expensive to fix (parts aren't easily available like they are for Camaros), much harder to resell, and far less reliable than the Camaro. It will also just be a worse, less fun car overall.

Dwhite - Powered by Caffeine, Daft Punk, and Corgis > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:24

On the Chrysler front look into Stealth's, I dont know about the reliability of them but they look like F-Body fighters but they are FWD. Also, W-Body's (Grand Prix, Monte Carlo etc.) reliable as hell, can take a good beating, and super common, especially in Michigan. Or a Blazer/Explorer, you can still find some in decent condition, its getting harder but they do exist up here.

Conan > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:26

Snow tires are both of your friends.

Jedidiah > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:28

I don't see any reason why he can't get a rwd car. They're not any less usable than fwd cars. If the weather gets really bad, just put a cinder block in the trunk or stay home or pull over; no sense in risking your life. If it gets that bad, then fwd cars will be struggling as well.

If he's interested in Camaros and Firebirds and is not opposed to learning how to use a stick, then he might be a budding car enthusiast.

desertdog5051 > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:32

I don't know a lot about them, but a friend had 2 Daytona's and little problem with either. The problem lies in buying a $4K car. It is bound to have some problems. Or have him search outside of MI and he hopefully will not be buying salt destroyed Uni-body cars.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > Dwhite - Powered by Caffeine, Daft Punk, and Corgis
08/31/2014 at 19:33

Good to know. I knew they were FWD, but I didn't know about the reliability. I keep telling him to get a Blazer or something along the lines, but he refuses. Tells me he wants something "cooler".

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > PetarVN, GLI Guy, now with stupid power
08/31/2014 at 19:35

He is saving up currently. Since he spends money like a fiend, I would put the cap around $4k. I agree with you. I keep telling him to get an S-10 or a Blazer, since that is good, reliable transportation. He refuses, though. Tells me he wants something "cool".

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
08/31/2014 at 19:38

That would be cool for him. Sadly, his parents would never pay for those lessons for him, since they don't help him buy anything. I keep looking at Camaros and Firebirds for him anyways, since that's what he truly wants.

Birddog > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:39

The K platform was plenty reliable.

Being in Michigan you may have a hard time finding a K derivative that isn't rotted to death underneath though.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > Conan
08/31/2014 at 19:39

Indeed they are. He would get them regardless of what he buys.

Conan > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 19:42

I think I'd go with the Camaro/Firebird for part access.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > Jedidiah
08/31/2014 at 19:49

I realize this. My concern is that he will most likely abuse a RWD car and get himself in trouble. I figured you could just put kitty litter or, as you said, a cinder block in the trunk to make it more usable. I don't know, I just feel like he would get himself injured in a RWD car. I think it would be great for him to have a Camaro or Firebird, since that's what he wants most.

He has always been decently interested in cars. I think it would be great for him to get more involved in automobiles.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > GhostZ
08/31/2014 at 19:59

I realize this. I just feel like he will abuse a RWD car a lot more. With that being said, I also feel like there would be a great possibility of him getting injured in a RWD car. He doesn't have any experience with RWD, and if he made a mistake, I don't think he would really know how to react. Did not really think about the Daytona and its lightweight 4-cylinder, though. Good call on that. As for the snow tires, he is extremely broke. He spends money like crazy. I explained to him the measures he would have to take with a RWD car in the winter. He told me he would get snow tires with any car he buys, but I don't think he realizes how expensive tires are. When he realizes this, I feel like he won't want to buy them.

Didn't really think about parts. I guess I thought, since it has the 2.2 that was put in several Chrysler products, that mechanical parts would be easy enough to find. Definitely a good point, though. I figured the same thing about the reliability and resale value, though.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > Birddog
08/31/2014 at 20:03

Good to know. I haven't really searched for any, but you're definitely correct.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > Conan
08/31/2014 at 20:04

That's what others have said. I would love for him to get a Camaro/Firebird, since that is truly what he wants. I'm just worried that he is more likely to get injured in a RWD car, since he has no experience with them.

Conan > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 20:05

It's possible. The tires will help. Could nab some classes too.

GhostZ > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 20:06

I got schooled elsewhere after that post. The 2.2 is reliable enough, listen to CrazedClay on this.

beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 20:11

Then he gets a job and pays for himself.

The argument is that the skidpan lessons are to help him learn how to drive in slippery conditions and become a safer driver , if there are specific snow/ice driving lessons in Michigan then take those.

I recommend skidpand/defensive driving courses for anybody who drives a car, let alone anyone who has to drive on ice and snow.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > Conan
08/31/2014 at 20:16

Yeah. I told him that he would need to get winter tires and some weight over the rear end (i.e. kitty litter, cinder block, etc.). Classes would be a good option for him, but he is broke as it is, and would really like to get a car. And his parents are more concerned about themselves, so they don't help him with anything. I'm sure it would be the same with classes.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > GhostZ
08/31/2014 at 20:18

He told me in another post. Damn, he's knowledgeable.

 > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 20:21

They were somewhat reliable when they were new. Last Daytona was made in 1993 though so it's nearly 20 years old now. Like any old car it will require maintenance. I suggest avoiding unless you are an enthusiast and have your heart set on one.

Is 2 door a must? Because that limits his choices quite a bit especially if it has to be American and cost 4k.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
08/31/2014 at 20:21

He already has a job. He already has to buy a car, so he probably would not listen to anyone on those classes, since that is just more money for him, even if it is for his own good. Also, as I explained, he spends money like crazy, so saving up for a car is difficult as it is.

beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 20:29

He doesn't have to get the lessons straight away, save up together and take them at the same time. They're fun.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage >
08/31/2014 at 20:38

Good to know. I figured that on the maintenance. I'm decent enough with maintenance, but my friend is not. He enjoys cars, but is definitely not an enthusiast. He has his heart set on a Camaro/Firebird, but I'm just thinking of alternatives.

Yes, two doors is a must. He doesn't think any four doors are "cool".

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > beardsbynelly - Rikerbeard
08/31/2014 at 20:39

Good thinking! May have to mention that one.

JawKnee > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 20:48

ohio winter: 16yrs old 1986 olds, 18yrs old 1966 chevelle, 25yrs old 1977 Corvette. All DD, all with a 125lb tool box over the rear axle.

Neutral is your friend, pump the breaks, man up.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > JawKnee
08/31/2014 at 20:51

Damn! Nice!

JawKnee > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 21:33

crazy part is the Corvette was a dream with snow tires! The cutlass was a tank and the chevelle had drum brakes so that was an adventure. The Vette though would drive past bewildered Toyota's and their stuck occupants.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > JawKnee
08/31/2014 at 21:52

Seriously? Wow! Would have never expected that. I bet the looks on the Toyota drivers' faces was priceless when they saw a Corvette drive past in the snow :D

JawKnee > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 22:01

Peoples minds implode seeing a Corvette in the snow. Granted we don't get as much in central Ohio as that unnamed state to the north.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > JawKnee
08/31/2014 at 22:03

I bet. Yeah, Ohio is definitely not as bad as Michigan. You guys still feel the pain, though.

JawKnee > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 22:06

I spent one winter break during college at a friends house in the U.P. never again!!!!

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > JawKnee
08/31/2014 at 22:14

Oh God. The most northern I've ever been is my grandparents house in Houghton Lake, which is around an hour and 45 minutes away from the Mackinac Bridge. I don't even want to imagine how terrible it is in the U.P.

ranwhenparked > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
08/31/2014 at 23:42

Tell him to get a Camaro and snow tires. Problem solved.

Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage > ranwhenparked
09/01/2014 at 00:07

That's what everyone else on here keeps saying. It's a good option, but he is not really experienced with RWD. That is my only worry. I feel like, if he were to screw up, he would not know how to react correctly. Otherwise, the Camaro is the ideal choice.

Jedidiah > Tuned-Port-Injected-Rage
09/01/2014 at 10:30

If he likes the car enough, he'll realize to stay out of trouble with it.

People generally have one close call or minor accident and then the irresponisble driving stage is over. It's part of learning with your first car.

Unless he is an adrenaline junkie, then he will probably do stupid things with any car regardless of the driveline.